This forum's view

 This forum's view

Hi Keil forum supporter

Everytime I look in this forum I wish to have a filter button to selct only Arm7 themes..

Isn't it possible to install a selction box feeded from the Toolset/Architetcure entry?

Would be very nice if it's possible to switch off uninteressted C166 and C51 or Arm7 threads..

hopeful

G.K.

 RE: This forum's view

you missed advanced search. you can use it after searching once in the non-platform specific way.

 RE: This forum's view

Thanks .. but I don't miss the advanced search..

It doesn't work!

If I search in Arm7 threads I get everything else too.

hopeful

G.K.

 RE: It doesn't work!

If it doesn't work, then click the 'Feedback' link in the left-hand panel and tell Keil!

http://www.keil.com/forum/feedback.asp

 RE: This forum's view

Guenter,

Thanks for pointing this out. Actually, the problem is not in the search. For some reason the forum threads are getting tagged with the wrong product specification for searching even though the product spec displays correctly when viewing the thread. We will figure this out as quickly as we can and update the web site.

As far as grouping or filtering the thread list, this is something we are looking into as a result of your prior posting. This is a feature we will add in the next 3-4 weeks (before the end of the year).

However, just because we don't add something immediately doesn't mean that we ignore comments from our end users. In reality, we get a lot of good feedback and we try to implement the best ideas in as timely a fashion as we can.

Jon

 RE: This forum's view

Aha.. thanks Jon :)

Than I don't write here http://www.keil.com/forum/feedback.asp
the same again.

@Andy
Thans for the link :)

hopeful

G.K.

 RE: This forum's view

or use this link:
http://www.keil.com/forum/search.asp

 RE: This forum's view

at one side the advanced search don't filter what I want
and one the other side I ask for a filter in the thread view, not in the search mask.

But I try it one more time ..
using the link..
entering advanced
clicking Arm7 product familiy
entering memory as keyword
and start searching...

The second found topic is from C51!
The advanced search dont work!!!

hopeful

G.K.

 RE: The advanced search dont work!!!

I tried to do the same search that you described:

http://www.keil.com/forum/search.asp?SA=ARM7&KW=&DY=&PL=&Q=memory&KB=ON&PM=ON&FR=ON&PG=1&PX=1&AV=ON

As you say, the second hit is "Winbond memory(SPI interface)" - which is about an 8051-derivative
http://www.keil.com/forum/docs/thread10906.asp

However, note that the originator of that post specified the architecture as 'Non-Specific (Generic)'

Presumably, as the search engine cannot tell that it is not related to your chosen architecture, it has to assume that it might be relevant - and so includes it in the results.

So another search option is required: to include or exclude "generic" posts.

And that is the fundamental flaw with this filtering idea - it relies on people correctly classifying their posts!

Often, a thread starts on an architecture-specific question, but later moves on to - or includes - non-specific issues...

 RE: The advanced search dont work!!!

And you have your answer :)

Don't change the family in a answer.. use that from original post.

And I think it's better than most of reader/writers here, which are able to use the family section are reading what they want
than given rookies a flat platform to spam..

And I mean that I CAN use.. not MUST use a filter.

hopeful
G.K.

 See recent thread...

... with a similar suggestion:

http://www.keil.com/forum/docs/thread13560.asp

 RE: See recent thread...

You see Andy - I learned my lesson (for now). Last time I tried to make a joke about the search engine (see link...) I got reprimanded (my intentions were good, though...)

 RE: See recent thread...

The biggest problem with a splitted forum is that it tends to reduce the number of people who gives answer. If I don't see the 8051 threads, I will not bother to jump to "the other side" just to see if there are any threads I may answer.

 RE: See recent thread...

You don't understand me..

Without any filter activated all thread should be visibel.

That guy who wants to answer for C51, C166 and/or Arm threads will be read everything... with or wothout a filter.

G.K.

 RE: See recent thread...

Yes, I understand you.

I just wanted to amplify the problem if Keil decides to go one step further, and have two separate forums, instead of just allowing end users filter the viewed threads.

 RE: See recent thread...

Don't go further.. and make problems were no are!

It's more useful to see/read/answer threads for a specific controller..

A rookie starting with C51 is unable to answer C166 stuff..
and a programmer who needs some C166 input is not interested in ~50% C51 threads.

How many people are able to answer all of them?
And how many from them are unable to let the filters deactivated?

A filter for a specific familiy increase the readablity and more users will read and answer golden tips ;)

A lot of forums are working very well with sub-forums..
And it's a lot easier to find topics ... definitly.

G.K.

 RE: See recent thread...

The rookies makes the same mistakes with _any_ used tool.

An experienced developer can answer a reasonable number of questions for other architectures.

Many forums have sub-forums. Many users gets locked into a single sub-forum, resulting in a reduced response chance.

A moderated forum with multiple sub-forums can have a significant number of threads being moved to another sub-forum.

 RE: See recent thread...

I just ask for a optional architecture filter button in the Thread list view, not for subforums.

The experienced developer which will answer for other architectures will be able to look in other architecture or don't use the optional filter buttons.

A lot of posts/answers in this forum may better never posted...
would be nice if some people will be isolated in a sub-forum.

G.K.

 RE: See recent thread...

would be nice if some people will be isolated in a sub-forumm

Forgive me, but I don't like the sound of this. Are you seriously suggesting a sub-forum for "less well-trained" people? That violated the entire spirit of this forum, let alone the fundamental principles of free speech and deliberation. No thanks.

 RE: See recent thread...

Well, now we're cooking.

Visitors have to solve differently hard "quests" and then we can get a rang of corporal, lieutenant, captain, ...

And the higher rank we get on this forum, the more exclusive - and narrow - VIP lounges we may visit. The elite of the elite may manage to climb to a level where no more questions are ever asked. Maybe once a year take a quick peek at the havoc of the lower echelons.

 RE: See recent thread...

ups.. locked.. not isolated sorry.

Per wrote:
Many users gets locked into a single sub-forum

Was not me who starts with isolated.. *ups*locked users.. this were your words.

.

I just asked for a filter button in thread view for the avaliable families...not more, please.

hopeful

G.K.

 RE: See recent thread...

No. Per meant "locked" in the sense that they will not have a chance to answer because they won't see the posts. You, on the other hand, clearly referred to physically locking out people. So let's be clear about the facts, please.

 RE: See recent thread...

The facts, good idea!

Just an architecture filter in thread view!

I wrote
nothing with or from sub-forum
nothing with or from advanced search

So please start another thread (or 2)if you like to talk about sub-forums or advanced search ;)

hopeful

G.K.

 RE: See recent thread...

Leave it. I think we covered the subject.

 RE: See recent thread...

Yes, I was talking about the tunnel vision that tends to creep in when people spends too long time limiting themselves (no access-rights locking, but private choices) into a single narrow sub-forum. Especially on a forum implementation where the user really has to switch back and forth between the sub-forum to pick up any new posts. A bit less so with the option to just filter content.

Two important things tends to happen:
- The number of posts every user needs to read gets down. This may be seen as good. But that also represents a loss of invigorating influences from other areas.

- Eacy post gets read by less people, and the number of people who may answer will be fewer. And the probability that a stupid answer will be accepted without comments gets higher. This is a bit similar to emailing answers directly to a requester - no good safety guard to make sure that the blind will not start to lead the blind.

In the end, it is often quite important to pick up influences from other fields just to get everything into perspective.

 Optional assignment for extra merit

I think it would be an interesting exercise to analyse a statistically-significant sample of threads, and see how many really were specific to only the stated toolset/architecture.

I suspect that the majority are not at all specific, but quite applicable to other - or all - architectures...

 RE: I just asked for a filter button

Actaully, you asked for "This forum's view" - and you've got plenty of views from the forum!

:-)

 RE: I just asked for a filter button

My own estimate - feel free to suggest other percentages:

90% of serial-port problems are probably generic.
70% of CAN questions
80% of uVision questions.
90% of "how do I ..." questions
50% of compiler problems
...

Beginners have a tendancy to start with very narrow and specific questions - but not because the question really is specific to a chip or compiler, but because they base the question on their knowledge instead of basing it on their lack of knowledge.

Instead of presenting a set of known facts and what they have done to get forward, they present a single fact with the assert: "this is wrong" and the question "why".

And most of the really processor-unique questions are so very unique that the number of people who can help may be very small. But remember: A lot of ARM developers have working knowledge of C51 chips, besides their "general" embedded knowledge.

In the end, my post about grading of people was no joke. You could give people scores and filter away noobs. That would make _your_ day nice. But only _if_ you have already spent the time gaining the required rank. You would have to "earn" your right to get a noise-free forum. But such a forum would be totally uninteresting for new Keil customers. They would get here with possibly very relevant questions but not be able to break through the "noob" filter until they have spent time helping real noobs. Obviously, a professional developer with a professional need can't afford the loss of calendar day for such a setup. And real noobs would never be able to break through the filter, so only Keil staff or very, very nice readers would spend the time helping the true noobs.

A separation on architecture on the other hand tends to put separating lines where no (or very weak) lines exists, since the synergy is so very high. The important factor is "embedded", not the marking on the processor.

 RE: I just asked for a filter button

Sorry, but I'm not a beginner and if I search for one architecture topics I don't waste my time reading the other threads, too less time.

And I know that the register sets from a C166 is completely different than the LPS-set.
So what kind of information is inside a thread with the other architecture?

If you have the time to read all the threads to look where you can help, it's your turn.

I just asked to add filter buttons which I can use, not must use!

.

G.K

 RE: I just asked for a filter button

I guess it is an issue of motivation. Some people here actually enjoy lending a helping hand, others are strictly looking for answers. I think this forum should primarily serve the first group of people.

 RE: I just asked for a filter button

And they can't help if there are filter buttons given to that users who like to switch off a MCU-family?

Is it too complex for that guys which think, that they can help, to handle few buttons?
Are you unable to leave buttons unpressed?

Ok, I understand you, thanks.

G.K.